Meet Scott Volk

SPEAKER_02 0:26

Welcome to the Monday Morning Men podcast. I'm Josh Swart here with Thomas Dillinger. And for the second time in podcast history, we have a guest. We do. Oh my gosh. You are the second one. You got beat out by Nathan Smith. You could have been the first.

SPEAKER_01 0:38

Part of that's just schedule. It's okay.

SPEAKER_02 0:40

Schedule, right? But we're glad you're here with us. We've got Scott Volk, who is just one of my favorite people ever. So thankful for you to be on the podcast with us. Thomas, you want to give an intro to Scott? You've known him for a long time. I have known him.

SPEAKER_01 0:54

I was thinking about it last night. I think it's like 15 or 16 years.

SPEAKER_00 0:57

My gosh, I took your wife down the aisle. You did. Yes. Yes.

SPEAKER_01 1:01

He actually drove me to the wedding. I didn't have my license at the time. But she's been like a mother to me, which has been amazing. Maybe if you're listening, it's just a joke. But yes, I've known Scott for a long time. We said this last time, and this is kind of our goal is that we're not trying to just get people on because they're great communicators, although you are. We appreciate all that you have done for the community, even being a pastor, my pastor for a little bit at Fire Church, but really to get men that are not only walking things out in obedience, but guys that really carry a heart for us to kind of walk the fruit that God has asked of us in our life. Which you are exemplifying that by the way you have discipled your children. By the way, I don't how long you've been married to Beth?

SPEAKER_00 1:43

38 years on the 38 years.

SPEAKER_01 1:45

Wow. I'm already celebrating. 38 years, right? So we we appreciate the faithfulness that's there, the faithfulness in which you led your church by loving people. So when we ask for guys to come on, right, we want to we want men that are actually walking out their faith, their practical, obedient faith in all areas of their life. And I think you exemplify this. Sure, Scott has written a book, which is amazing. Um, you know, done great things, but those are not the highlights. That's not what we want to elevate here. We want to see the simple things of just following Jesus and the privacy of their own homes. Which we think you do. Thank you so much for having me on. I mean, super, super blessed to be here.

SPEAKER_02 2:20

That's awesome. One of the one of my favorite ways to like judge fruit by people is their kids and like their kids' lives and like the legacy that's there. And I mean, we see that evident very much in your family line. So God.

SPEAKER_00 2:32

Um I hope to have that for my family one day too. If you hope to, you will, because I I think God uh definitely honors the desires of our hearts. And if it's your intent, our intent to raise kids in a way that's pleasing to the Lord, I

The Fruit of Hospitality

SPEAKER_00 2:49

think God's gonna give us every opportunity to accept his invitation to what he calls us to do. And I know you guys wanted to talk about hospitality today. And um, if I could just start off with this story, we we I was pastoring church, we didn't have a building, we're meeting at the YMCA, and uh people come in really from all over. It was kind of like the the good old days. It was, I mean, the church was growing in this particular Sunday. The youth were leading the worship at the church. And um my daughter was on the keyboard, my son was playing violin, my other son was playing drums, and my other daughter, I had four at that time, I now have five, which is another story that we can talk about another podcast. Uh and so all four of my kids were up there, and there were probably four other four other kids up there, and um the and the youth pastor who was also our worship leader. And I was sitting next to one of the elders of the church in the front row, and he looks at me and he said, You must be so proud of your kids. And his name was Tom. I said, Tom, it's just amazing. I I love I love seeing this. And he looks at me and he says, That's the fruit of hospitality. And I looked at him and I was like, the fruit of hospitality. And um, our house has always been an open home. We've always had people either living with us. As a matter of fact, Thomas, your wife lived with us. Yes, she did. Before she was married, thankfully. But but but she she and a whole string of other people throughout our married life have lived with us. And that comment by Tom on that Sunday morning started me on a journey of just looking through scriptures and seeing where hospitality was mentioned in scripture. And if there is one thing that I could put a stamp on where hospitality is concerned, it's that hospitality brings life. Everywhere in scripture where you see hospitality mentioned, life is mentioned with it. Let's just think of a couple of biblical examples. You've got

Hospitality Brings Life

SPEAKER_00 5:07

Rahab, the harlot. I don't I don't think we need a dictionary to figure out what a harlot is. She was a harlot. And the uh these spies are sent out, right? And Rahab hides them in her home, correct? And as a result of her hiding these people in their home, her life is spared. Her and her family's life is spared. Why? Because she opened up her home and she showed hospitality. I'll just give one other, maybe we could talk about others as we go. I'm thinking of uh the Shunammite woman in the book of Kings. And Elisha the prophet walks by her home every day. Maybe it's not the Shunammite, maybe it's maybe it is the Shunammite, whatever. She invites Elisha the prophet into her home and asks her husband, build him a room where he can stay. I perceive he is a prophet. And Elisha, so so blessed. Elisha says, What can I do for you? Uh can I introduce you to the king? Well, what do you need? And she goes, Oh, what I really need is a child. I'm I'm childless. And the prophet looks at her and says, This time next year, you will have a son. And uh this woman, this barren woman, this woman with a womb who who was incapable of conceiving a year later ends up birthing a child. One other, while I'm thinking about it, since I said this time next year, there's two places in scripture where the phrase this time next year shows up. One in the scripture that I was just talking about from the book of Kings, and the other one in the book of Genesis, when Abraham, 99 years old, is uh sees three men walking. Now, the Bible says they were angels, but I'm not sure how you would identify an angel. I would identify him with by wings and a and a halo. And uh these guys were not wearing either of those. They were they were men. And Abraham says, Come, he's 99 years old, come in. And they he's hurrying to fix lunch for these three men, one of whom was the Lord Himself. It's an incredible story. Abraham and Sarah have lived with a promise that they were going to birth a son, who would end up birthing a nation, and through this nation, all other nations on the earth would be blessed. Abraham was 99. Abraham's name means exalted father. Actually, Abram means exalted father. When God changed his name to Abraham, that means uh father of multitudes, yet he had no children. He lived with a promise that actually contradicted his reality. These guys come in and um they look at Abraham and they say, This time next year,

What Hospitality Actually Means

SPEAKER_00 8:25

you will have a son. Abraham and Sarah both laughed, and they actually named their son Laughter, Isaac. But what's the common theme with Rahab and the woman with Elisha and Abraham? They opened up the doors of their home. They showed hospitality to strangers. Hospitality literally means treating strangers like an honored guest. And out of that, life came. There's there's a plethora of other examples in the Bible. But that Sunday morning, I looked at Tom and he said, This is the fruit of hospitality. And my whole world changed where hospitality is concerned. Because now it's like when you look at it in scripture, it's like there it is. You open up your home and things change. And I know we can have a discussion about this, but I just really want to encourage you guys and and all who are listening. One of the one of the most difficult things to do is to open up your home. Because when you have people in your house, you can't pretend anymore. You can your your your kids might not be perfect. You might have a little scuffle with your wife. Uh you're bringing people into your home. You're letting people stay in your home. Um, I and I know both of you are both of you are hospitable and have hospitable families, but I'm telling you something. There is something about authenticity of life, something that the Lord loves about men and women who open up their home to strangers. So thank you for noticing or even commenting on my children. I can take partial credit for that because we tried to raise them, but the other credit goes to the people like Thomas' wife Mary, who lived in our home, who brought music into our home, taught our kids piano or voice, and the other people who stayed in our home who really built a kingdom mentality into my kids. And it's really, really beautiful.

SPEAKER_02 10:29

So cool. Yeah. I it's such an opposite dynamic to most people our age these days, where it's like you want to protect your family, you want to protect that unit and like that privacy of your home. Yeah.

The Early Church Didn't Live in Isolation

SPEAKER_02 10:40

Can you walk us through what it looked like for you and Beth like in the early years? Yeah. Was this something that you guys that your family did going into marriage or her family? Like, where did this start? How did you guys walk through the operating? That's a great question, Josh.

SPEAKER_00 10:53

I um I've lived in a community in northern Minnesota. So in my teenage years, we lived, we weren't Amish, but if you looked at it, it was like, what are these guys doing? We lived, there were like 75 people on a piece of property that shared meals together, that shared cars, that we had a common food room. We were brought up in an atmosphere that attempted to reflect the early church. Because when you look at the early church, what were some of the things, I mean, think about it, that marked the initial planting of Jesus' work. Uh, Acts 2, Acts 4, um, they lived all things common. They thought that what they had was not their own. Daily, they went from house to house breaking bread together. Uh, they prayed together, they they worked together, they shared life and possessions together. Because I was raised in that kind of atmosphere. Um, when we got married, sometimes I would get into a little bit of trouble with Beth because on the way home from work, I would say, honey, I invited so-and-so over to dinner. And she was like, she was like, Well, you know, I'd appreciate you asking me first. Duh, of course. Um, but my parents, we lived in a trailer, you guys. Our trailer was 12 feet wide and 68 feet long. And I rarely remember a time when somebody was somebody outside of our core family was not living with us. My parents practiced this. And uh so in our marriage early on, people kind of gravitated to us. Would you could you know, can we stay with you? Or we would open up our home. Would you know, would you would you like to come and stay with us? It wasn't easy. It's it's a um it it's not great for privacy. But sometimes privacy in the fences and the and the locks on the doors that we put to protect ourselves sometimes can be keeping us from one of the greatest gifts that God has for us. So Beth and I grew into it. Both of us have had hospitable homes, but we grew into it. I've got my dad living with me now, and uh we have people at our house all the time. And my dad, my dad looks at me and Beth, you know, Scotty, he calls me Scotty. Scotty, how do you do this? I said, Dad, you you taught me how to do this. He goes,

Hospitality Is Something You Pursue

SPEAKER_00 13:40

Well, you far exceeded us, you know, because our house is this constant flow. Um, I believe, I believe that there's a biblical invitation. Uh the Bible says to show hospitality. I think it's Romans 12. I I can't remember. I don't have my Bible in front of me, you guys, but it's like be fervent in spirit, you know, fervent in prayer, boiling in spirit. And then at the end it just says, show hospitality. I looked up the word show in in Greek. I don't know much about Greek, but that word show hospitality sometimes is translated practice hospitality, but the word literally means to pursue it. Pursue hospitality. And it's it's like you ever see one of those um those car chases in California? They're not so prevalent now, but you're watching something. I remember, you know, in my early married days, they would interrupt television shows and show like this cop chase in in California. Obviously, O.J. Simpson is the the famous one. But but, you know, these cars are going down the road and the cops are pursuing them. And maybe the guy that's commentating is, oh, you know, they're going 100 miles an hour down the interstate. You know, the cops are ready to throw out, you know, some nails on the freeway, and then they throw out the nails and the the tires of the car pop and the car reels over, and then the guys jump out of their car and the cops are chasing. They get the guy. They get him. They're pursuing him. In the same way, I think hospitality should be pursued by anyone who calls Jesus their their Lord and King. We've got to pursue it because if we don't, we're not gonna catch it. But if we catch it, we're gonna have life.

SPEAKER_01 15:34

I wanna just we'll come back to that. We're gonna put a pin it because I want to do a circle here. I have a I have a hot take I want to ask you about. Obviously, uh in St. Timothy, the requirement for elders and deacons, he puts it in that scripture, he says, to not be drunkards, to not be given

When Christian Leaders Become Inaccessible

SPEAKER_01 15:48

to sexual immorality, and to be given to hospitality. Come on. And the way that it reads, essentially, if you're not given to hospitality, he equates it almost like that that's the way it goes. You you you are hospitable and you also don't do these evil things. Do you believe? Like, here's my question. As someone who my dad's a pastor, I'm not in any sort of leadership, but there's the more that I'd call it fame, it's like you know, Christian fame becomes a thing, right? You celebrity pastors are celebrity. I've noticed this trend where a lot of them are not hospitable. I've been around those. It's terrible. Do you, which we all know in Proverbs, a man given to isolation is given to his own desires. There's a reason we're to be hospitable so we're involved. Why do you think that this is a such an issue, especially for the people we look up to that they're just not hospitable? You said talked about protection. I'm just the hot take here a little bit is like for especially many leaders, if you're listening to this, maybe you're even a leader at your business and you don't want to have your employees over, or you don't, I don't want to be careful building a relationship. Is there an excuse for that? Or is this just something culturally we've accepted?

SPEAKER_00 16:45

I I don't think there's an excuse for it in the world that we call Christian. If you're gonna be a kingdom person, you're gonna live kingdom lives. This hospitality thing, uh, where uh the requirement for elders and leaders is so overlooked. And what you're seeing today is the fruit of that overlooking. We have the celebrity culture because we're not living and putting people in positions where they are hospitable. We we used to do these um newcomer gatherings at the church that I pastored. What we called it engage. It was the engage class, and it was a three-week class. And the first two weeks were at the church, the third week was at my house for dinner. And we would have just everybody come over to the house. We did this uh three times or four times a year. Um, and there were 20, 30 people. I can't tell you how many people came up to me and said, We've never been in a pastor's home before. Messed up. We've never been in a pastor's home. What does that mean? Are you are you kidding me? Because what we've done is we've elevated the roles that people play in church. And we've made this distinction. We've got clergy, we've got laity, and neither the two can mix. You know why churches are are lacking power and awe today is because we're not doing what brought the awe and the power in Acts chapter two and Acts chapter four. Agreed. Meeting together from house to house. It's like it's it's not from church to church, from building to building, from office to office. Get people in your home. And even if it's a stretch beyond stretches, have somebody. There are some people who can't afford to have people over to their home for dinner. You know what I say? Just bring people over. Have toast together. Have coffee. Sit sit on your patio, let your kids play. Uh, I'm telling you, we've created this culture in the church. I can't speak too much to the business world. You guys are more in that realm than I am. But it's probably not a wise thing from a worldly perspective to have employees, underlings, you know, be around you because if you get too close to them, they might see your imperfections and not respect you. Because now, where does respect come? You're the man, you show the power. But I'm telling you, there's something about weakness that we don't even get anymore. If we allow people to see our weaknesses, that actually opens the door for them to grow into a place of saying, oh gosh, you know, I'll never be a businessman like Josh. I'll never do the things that Thomas does. It's like, wait a second, you know, check out my family. Come on over, hang out. My kids run around, they do the same thing your kids do. We've we've got struggles. It's the same in the church. Why do we feel like pastors have to present themselves as perfect people? And if the only thing you do is see them on Sunday and then they go out the back door and show up a week later, I'm telling you, they might be wonderful, wonderful people. They might be great communicators. But if you want to talk about the qualifications for a pastor and a shepherd, it doesn't seem to be lining up with what we're seeing today by and large.

SPEAKER_01 20:11

Well, and I think the bummer is that if you're not setting that example, right, we're setting the example that we're achieving perfection in high communication, is obviously the key, as opposed to just living, like you said, our weaknesses and our normal life. Yeah. And then we see it trickle down to obviously the parishioners who are now, well, I'm not going to practice it because my leaders aren't. And one thing

“I Don't Have the Gift of Hospitality”

SPEAKER_01 20:28

I hear people say is like, well, I don't have, I don't have the gift of hospitality, which is I'm like, I don't know what verse that is. I don't have the gift of patience when I'm annoyed. Like, I don't think that's a thing. So on that, you know, you talked about, I mean, so it's a qualification that it's needed for obviously the elders. It's a qualification. God commands us to be hospitable. Yeah. So it's not a gifting, just well, that person has the gifting. No, you're all required to do it. And as you said, we need to practice it. So on that, for some guys listening, maybe they're not given normally. A lot of us aren't. Yeah. But we are still called to it to practice it. What are some, like you said, just have people over, give like two easy tips. Maybe for someone that maybe can't afford it, like you said, here's a couple, maybe if it's a play date or it's hey, we're just gonna walk outside together in the neighborhood. Or just little things. Or what if, and then this is the last thing I really want you to talk about because I have had this happen a lot. I've had a lot of men open to hospitality the more that I talk in private, which has been refreshing. What I'm finding is, especially for the men, that their wives are not open to it. To be fair to them, usually, especially if they're eating dinner, a lot of times the the wives are cooking, they're trying to clean the house, they're dealing with the kids. It's a lot more of a requirement for the wives than it is a man. I just send a text, right? Yeah. And obviously pitch him where I can. So to the questions, what's something real quickly practically, if maybe finances are, you know, you can't just order take out. And then the second thing, how do we get our wives on board for this command that God has given us? Yeah, well, you just whoop your wives and I was gonna say, yeah. That's what you gotta do. Yeah, that's what you gotta do. That's a different podcast. More cut that out of the podcast. You have a job, Corey.

SPEAKER_00 22:03

Obviously, you can't the whole issue of marriage is to becoming one. So I would say um, if if if hospitality is not something that both are right now willing to dive into, at least let's just open the scriptures and talk about it and pray together. Lord, give us grace. So to be hospitable. But the Bible doesn't say to pray

Hospitality Is Going to Cost You

SPEAKER_00 22:31

for hospitality. It says to pursue it. And if hospitality does bring life, what does the Bible say? The enemy comes to rob, kill, and destroy. The devil's going to do everything he can to keep you from experiencing life. So when a husband and wife come together and go, okay, we want life, if one pathway to life for your marriage and for your children and for your children's children, which is what righteous men think about, then we say, okay, let's just do it. Practice. And practice actually infers that you're not going to be perfect at it. Practice infers that you might stumble and bumble, but you will never regret having people in your house, even if they were horrible. Guess what does the Bible say? Um practice hospitality without grumbling or complaint. It's like, okay, uh, I just remember this. We we invited this family to Which pause for a second.

SPEAKER_01 23:33

Just so you know, that means Jesus knows that there are annoying people in your home. Like he gets it. That's exactly right. Like sometimes we think it's like everybody's great.

SPEAKER_00 23:40

And it's like, no, they're not. We had we had people come and stay at our house in in uh Florida. We just bought a new house, we had white carpet, and um, we Beth served uh spaghetti uh for dinner. And all of a sudden we had, I don't know if you remember our house in Pensacola Thomas, but we had a a living room that was connected to the dining room that was connected to the kitchen, and uh and then there was a wall in the middle. So you can actually run laps in our home. I like that. So their five-year-old son, after dinner, um, decides he's gonna just run laps. And the mother says, honey, don't do that. You know, sometimes you throw up. Um if you're if you're and I'm like, no, no, no, no, no, no. And all of a sudden, on the white carpet, in our brand new white carpet, in our brand new house, this guy decides to purge his uh his spaghetti. Yeah. And for the five years that we lived in that house, or four years, as hard as we tried to get that stain out, it was there. And it was like a reminder to me. Do it without grumbling or complaining. Um, I say practical number one, just practice. Yeah. Just do it. You're not gonna be perfect, but if your heart is to open up your home, our relationships can no longer be based on um what somebody does for me. They cannot be transactional. Our relationships need to be giving relationships. We're gonna have you, we don't expect anything in return. We have people over, show the love of Jesus, care for them, look them in the eye. I've I've been to plenty of homes where I sat there. I remember one in particular. I was in the home of a well-known person, and I sat next to this person who didn't ask me one question. Wow. And I was sitting there, you know, it's it's like I did not feel welcomed. Look people in the eye. Put your put your um electronics away, focus on people as they're in your home, talk to them, ask them about their. You will be shocked at how energizing and and life-giving it is for you. Why is it life-giving? Because we're giving. And the Bible says give and it will be given back. Pressed down, shaking together, running over. So I would say that. Anyway, I don't know.

SPEAKER_02 26:04

Yeah, that's great. I wait. So you're saying this isn't easy?

SPEAKER_00 26:08

Thankfully, thankfully, it's not easy. Thankfully, it's costly, and anything of value is costly. So you do it, your your carpet might be ruined, your your refrigerators may be emptied. Uh just one quick story. We live, we lived, my my son Joe, uh, we put up a basketball hoop in our at our former home in our driveway. And uh Joe Joe just invited all of his buddies in the neighborhood. And I I remember Beth and I, the the day before we we brought grow bought groceries. We weren't we weren't making that much money, we were pastoring the church. And so we we just load up with snacks for the kids, you know, and and in one day, in one day, our cupboards were empty. And it was like, oh my gosh, oh my gosh. But you guys, I gotta tell this to you. When I look at the quality of my family life together now, I would not trade empty cupboards or or thrown up on carpets for any of that. The fact that you could even say, I see the fruit in your kids, thank God. But that that's the Lord honoring his word, right? By us honoring his word anyway.

SPEAKER_01 27:35

I agree. I think that's a great place. We'll we'll wrap it up here, but just even those last.

SPEAKER_00 27:40

I want to go on another hour, dude. Come on.

SPEAKER_01 27:42

You know, I mean, don't cut this short. I mean, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 27:45

Show me some hospitality.

SPEAKER_01 27:46

We gotta practice,

Let People Into Your Real Life

SPEAKER_01 27:47

we gotta start cleaning that house right now. I uh a couple of things, just even on that, that Mary and I have learned. One, yes, uh, a clean house is obviously great. It's not a requirement. It's not it, it's it doesn't have to be, it doesn't have to be in. I mean, if you have to order pizza or have to be super simple. I mean, we've made frozen pizzas before for people. I mean, that's how simple it has. I love it. So we're gonna practice this week. If you're a pastor listening to this, I want to encourage you on one thing. Francis Schaefer, who is one of the great theologians of our day, uh, they believe struggle with uh extreme autism of some sort of somehow on the spectrum. And he really had a hard time talking to people. But every Sunday night, his wife had people at the dinner table, even though he struggled to talk. And uh, she told him to his face, God has called you to be a leader and you walk in sin when we don't have people over. This is a strong, powerful woman who understood that calling. So if you're a pastor, you know, I saw on Twitter the other day, a pastor said, you know, you get to meet with me and it's a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity. And it made me so sad that that was that came from his pulpit, and people were like celebrating. I'm like, that's a messed up church. But if you were listening to that, you're called to set the example for people. And if you struggle with hospitality, obviously this is something that it's a requirement. We're walking out obedience here. It's not about what you feel like, it's about the doing. And if your wife isn't on board, I would encourage you, like you said, sit down, open the scriptures, pray together. You know, you are the priest of your home, and that it's in the shepherd. So to encourage and help everybody walk in obedience, obviously be graceful and help your wife. That would be my big thing. Make sure it's okay to have someone over clean the house with her, offer to make dinner, like whatever you can do, make it cost something for you. It may not cost something to send a text, but make it cost something for you guys. Um, but this is something God has called us to. And I think because we don't do this, it inbreeds a little bit of sin, unfortunately, because we can be isolated and no one's in our business. Two, it can it breeds pride, right? We give out the nice persona to everybody else. Look at my life. I'm great on Instagram, and then you see me and you're like, oh my gosh, Thomas's house is messy, his kid was disrespectful. Um, and we don't want that. This can be life-giving to you, but it is gonna cost you something, but it's worth it because I mean, as you see now fruit, 30 plus years later, thank God. You've got kids that are extremely hospitable, you've got people that want to come over, right? And I already know just and you know, experiencing with Scott, it's easy to judge people on the outside, and I'll never forget this. I had someone at my house, just so you guys listen, especially you pastors, I had someone at my house who was not happy with Scott Volk at the time, and they were telling me this, and and their opinion was a certain way, and but you know what they said? I watched them defend you on social media, and I had a conversation with them, and they're like, I've been in that man's home and he loves me. So even though this is my hot take, I might be wrong. And grace was immediately given there because what was the person's name? Yeah, I'm glad you asked that. Yes, I'm glad you asked that. He's in this room. No, I'm just gonna say uh and immediately what I loved about it is I was like, This you opening your home, all of a sudden offer grace. And so for you pastors that are out there, like, I don't want to let people in. It's like, you know, this is my hot take because I'm seeing something else online. It's like, you know what? But I know that man, just be known by your community in in in whatever capacity,

The Awkwardness Is Worth It

SPEAKER_01 30:55

your business owner, let your employees in. You're like, well, I don't want to cross pond, dude. You're called to love people, not run a business. Yeah, you know, so good. All these things. Any other last thoughts you have, Joshua?

SPEAKER_02 31:05

I mean, we we were over at your house a month or so ago for a dinner thing, and it felt like I was back at youth night in your 30s. That's right. 30s, right? It was like we had waffles and ice cream and we played games. Like, yeah, it was the best time ever, right? While his dad tried to sleep and we kept him up. That's right, that's right. I will say, I remember uh Christy and I when we were first married, there was a small group that we were doing, and every week it was so awkward. Like it was a group of people from the church that we went to, and it was like three or four weeks of just like awkward conversations, everybody's very different opinions, all of this stuff. And Christy was like, I'm done, I don't want to do this anymore. And I was like, just give it another couple weeks. Like we can't just back out of this small group like this early on. And sure enough, week after week, these people just became the most like genuine, authentic friends of ours, to where when we were, you know, missionaries overseas, some of them came and visited us, and like they're people that we still stay in touch with now. But like, it's awkward, it's uncomfortable at first, it costs you something. The dings on your drywall, the the stuff like the stuff that you that bother me, like is exposed to everybody else. Um, it's not easy, but it's so worth it. So worth it. So worth it.

SPEAKER_01 32:20

It's not your stuff anyway. Exactly, right?

SPEAKER_02 32:23

And and for me, as somebody who's like, I want things in order, I want course, I want it to be tidy. Yeah, to have friends, kids come over and the house is torn apart and all this stuff, it just drives me crazy. But it's also it's like exposing my pride, it's exposing my yeah, the things that aren't of the Lord, and so it's a good exercise for me. That's awesome, bro.

SPEAKER_01 32:45

And God's cleaning up our lives constantly. Are you kidding me? So you're a messmaker, man. You're exactly talking about I love it. I love it. So great. All right, that's good. I think we're done.

SPEAKER_02 32:56

Great, thank you guys so much for having me. Yeah, Scott, this was awesome. I'm sure people are gonna get a lot out of this. Guys, if you're not practicing hospitality, I think we just got a masterclass in somebody who's doing it on a high level.

SPEAKER_01 33:08

Well, we always talk about don't do this alone, get in a community one way. If you don't have a community to develop it, invite people over.

SPEAKER_02 33:14

Exactly. With that, we'll close out and we'll see you next week.

SPEAKER_01 33:18

Sounds good.